c/p from another board great read !!!


Switches

First there is a switch inside (almost) every LNBF, it is a Voltage Controlled Switch, this causes the LNBF to send out V polarity transponders or H polarity transponders, the voltage in the coax cable coming from the receiver is what switches this switch, 13volts = V transponders, 18volts = H transponders.
This is why you can NOT simply add a splitter to run 2 receivers from 1 LNB port, only 1/2 the channels are ever on the cable at one time. There is one Voltage Controlled switch on a single output LNBF, there are two Voltage Controlled switches on a Dual LNBF.

External switches
There are only 2 main switches that work with most if not all FTA receivers and regular(legacy) LNBs they are:
22khz switch, connects 2 LNBs to one receiver
DiSEqC 4x1 switch, connects up to 4 LNBs to one receiver.


22khz switches, these are really simple, they look like a splitter but are a simple ON or OFF switch, 0khz and 22khz are the 2 input ports then one out to receiver port, when you have 22khz OFF in your receiver the 0khz port is connected, when you have 22khz ON in your receiver the 22khz port is connected.
This switch is for hooking up 2 LNBs to one receiver.

The 22khz switch has big brother it is a DTV or 22khz 4x4 switch, this switch has 4 inputs to hook up 2 DUAL LNBs and can be hook to as many as 4 receivers.
2 inputs are labeled 13v,0khz & 18v,0khz (remember the LNBFs internal switch), and the other 2 inputs are 13v,22khz & 18v,22khz. This allows both polarities from each LNB to be inside the switch at all times, so any of the 4 receiver can access any polarity on either of the 2 LNBs.
These switches also come in a 4x8 for up to 8 receiver hook ups to 2 satellites.


DiSEqC is a pulse switch, it also uses a 22khz signal but it uses a one time pulse to set the DiSEq switch to 1 of 4 ports, these switches come in 2x1 and 4x1 models, for 2 LNBs to ONE receiver or 4 LNBs to ONE receiver, respectively, these can NOT be used for more than one receiver, you must use another DiSEq switch for second receiver.
DiSEqC-1 or 2 or 3 or 4 in your menu will cause the DiSEqC switch to switch to that numbered port, some receivers use A, B, C, D instead of 1, 2, 3, 4.
This "pulse" is only sent once, if the DiSEq switch is to far away from the receiver it can miss it and not change ports, some times toggling back and forth between channels can make the change happen, the pulse is repeated each time you change channels, but moving the switch closer to the receiver can improve its performance.


DiSEqC = Digital Satellite Equipment Control, this was designed for FTA receivers.
DiSEqC switches come in 2 main flavors, Committed(1.0) and Uncommitted(1.1), but also Committed 2-way(2.0) and UnCommitted 2-way(2.1).
Committed(1.0) switches are the most common and are what come with the receivers.

These switches require FACTORY software in your FTA to operate properly, 1.0 means your receiver can operate Committed switches ONLY, 1.1 means it can operate Committed AND UnCommitted switches, 1.2 means it can operate Committed and UnCommitted plus DiSEqC motor controls.
2.0 is the same as above, 2.0, 2.1, 2.2 but the receiver can also receive information back from the switch, 2.0 switches receive the pulse command from the receiver, then change ports, they then send back a confirmation to the receiver, if a 2.0 receiver doesn't receive the confirmation it will send the DiSEqC pulse again and again until the switch confirms it is on the right port.

Putting 2 DiSEqC Committed switches on one cable is a no-no, which is why there are Committed and UnCommitted types of switches, a Committed switch is placed first in line (DiSEqC pulse comes from the receiver so first would be closest to the receiver), then you can hookup an UnCommitted switch to the Committed switch, the Committed switch will ignore the UnCommitted switches commands.
Committed 4x1 switches are about $20, UnCommitted 4x1 switches are about $80, so unless you have to have 16 LNBs hooked up to one receiver stick with Committed switches.

There are no multiple receiver DiSEq switches for Legacy(regular) style LNBs


22khz switches and DiSEq switches can work well together, with one restriction, the 22khz switch must come AFTER the DiSEq switch.
So you can hook one 22khz switch to two LNBs then hook the output of the 22khz switch to port 1 on the DiSEq switch. So instead of 4 LNBs you could have 5 LNBs hooked up, you can add a 22khz switch to each DiSEqC port for a total of 8 LNBs hooked up to one receiver.


Dishnet Legacy switches, are designated by SW, like sw21 or sw64 these do not use true DiSEqC pulses so do not work with FTA receivers.
Legacy TWIN and QUAD LNBs have built-in SW switches so also do not work with FTA receivers


DishPro TWIN or QUAD LNBs, have an internal DiSEqC switch, so EACH port on the LNB has access to either of the 2 LNBs inside, 110 or 119, DiSEqC 1 = 119 and DiSEqC 2 = 110, these LNBs require a DP Channel List.

DishPro external switches, there are 2 now, a DP34 and a DPP44, both of these use true DiSEqC pulses so will work with FTA receivers but you must use DP LNBs to take advantage of the multiple receiver aspect of this switch.
(The DPPlus LNB does NOT work with FTA receivers, it does not use true DiSEqC)
If you hook up a standard(non-DP) LNB to a DP switch and more than one receiver you can only get 1 polarity at a time from that LNB. If you just have 1 receiver hooked up to it, it has been reported to work fine. I have not tested this.


Multiple receiver switches
If you are using standard(non-DP) LNBs you need 1 LNB port per receiver, it's that simple, if you have a Dual LNB it has 2 ports so you can hook up 2 receivers, if you want a 3rd receiver hooked up you need a 3rd LNB port.
Single output(non-DP) LNBs can only ever be used with 1 receiver.
But if you have a Dual LNB you can expand it to 4 or 8 or even 16 outputs.
This is done with a Multi-switch, they come in 3x4, 3x8 and 2x16.
You run 2 cables from the Dual LNB to the multi-switch you then have 4 LNB outputs(or 8 or 16), if you have 2 LNBs you want then you need 2 Multi-switches, one for each LNB.
The 4x4 22khz switch is 2 multi-switches in one case, and you can use these along with DiSEq 4x1's to setup a multi-satellite multi-receiver system.



C/Ku switch or 0/12v is a voltage controlled switch, most FTAs do not have this option but some do, these do not work from a coax cable signal as 22khz and DiSEqC do, they require 2 wires to the switch, the switch has 2 inputs and one output, at 0volts one port is connected at 12v the other port is connected.
On the back of the receiver will be a GND(ground) and 12v(12volts) this is where the 2 wires to the switch are connected, and there will be an option in the menu for 0/12v ON or OFF.

Great reading, inded. Thanks SKUNNER for passing it along.
Somehow, I got a question, in the section of multi switch, about the 4x4 switch could be used along with Diseqc sw.
There are 2 dual LNB's (i.e. 4 lines in total), 2 lines from one LNB are connected to the input 1 and 2 of the 4x4 SW, then 2 lines from the 2nd LNB connected to input 3 and 4 of the 4x4.
From the 4x4, there are 4 outputs. These outputs will contain signal from both LNB's. Right? Is it possible to feed this output directly to an FTA box, without using Diseqc sw? What port # should be selected from the FTA box setup?

If the answer is NO for the above question.
How do I use these output along with the Diseqc sw? What port# should be selected from an FTA box?
Thank you.

if you have 2 LNBs you want then you need 2 Multi-switches, one for each LNB.
The 4x4 22khz switch is 2 multi-switches in one case, and you can use these along with DiSEq 4x1's to setup a multi-satellite multi-receiver system.
ok as stated a c/p and the majority of my experience useing switches are trial and error after reading these c/p's but with that said once you set something up with particulliar equipment , you leard from your experience

so to answer your question i wouls say diseqc to off 22khz on and commit to what ever out port your stb is connected to .

again this is just my theory on reflection on the c/p ( but i think that would work)

good luck and please reply back with you findings so we can all learn from each other:)

thanks skunk...you are great help here man

I agree with the above with the exception of SW type switches. Coolsat receivers have SW type switch control options so a SW21 would work on a coolsat box. Also to answer the above question ref out of a multiswitch right into a receiver, you could do it. but if your only using two lnbs, I would consider disq switches because their cheaper and usually come with the receiver.

Im tryin to get a superdish the 105 single output LNB to multiple rooms. Swapping that out to a dual output lnb isnt easy.



JD

U need the right combo of LNB's and switches.

This document is directed to novice,and slightly experienced hobbyists.Its purpose is to help those in need of answers to basic switching setups;It is not directed to those involving 2 or3 types of LNB's to 5 receivers...you should already be blueprinted.


You must determine your setup and gear.Here we will try to get you started with the most efficient and reliable switches.

One LNB to one receiver..............no switch needed
One LNB to two receivers...............no switch needed(requires a DUAL output LNB)
Two LNB's to one receiver............This can be done with any one of the following; AB switch/2x1 diseqc/4x1 diseqc/22Khz switch/4x4 multiswitch

(1) A/B switch from wallyworld or Ratshack;works great,switches every time...you will need 2 cables run to switch.
(2) 2x1 diseqc switch;works reasonably well;antennae settings must coincide with switch inputs.
(3) 4x1 diseqc switch;Probably the most widely spread and unreliable switch on the market.Performance level is abysmal.Does NOT like 2 different types of LNB,long cable runs,water,humidity,or anything else.Best brand by far for a good price is Chieta,and Spaun for high end...better be for the money.
(4) 22Khz switch; Very reliable tone switch.Easily installed and reasonably priced.One line from each LNB to switch,and one line out to receiver.Highly recommended.
(5) 4x4 multiswitch; Very versatile switch that requires dual LNB's.It can drive up to 4 receivers,and is 22Khz operated as well.These were around in the old D*V days and have an excellent track record and are highly recommended.

Two LNB's to two receivers..........This is where multiple switches is required in 3 of 4 examples.

(1) 2x1 diseqc switch;2 required for this installation,as well as 2 dual LNB's.The outputs from each LNB will go to a separate 2x1 switch,and from switch to receiver.
(2) 4x1 diseqc switch;2 required for this installation,as well as 2 dual LNB's.The outputs from each LNB will go to a separate 4x1 switch,and from switch to receiver.
(3) 22Khz switch; 2 required for this installation,as well as 2 dual LNB's.The outputs from each LNB will go to a separate 22Khz switch,and from switch to receiver.
(4) 4x4 multiswitch; 1 required for this installation,as well as 2 dual LNB's.The outputs from LNB #1 will go to Sat A inputs,and the outputs from LNB #2 will got to Sat B inputs.Do not be concerned with the 18v and 13v allocation,as the switch "freezes" these voltages within the unit.Set 1 sat to 22Khz ON,and the other to OFF(in your settings).
This unit can drive up to 4 receivers.

Three LNB;s to one receiver...........As much as we hate to say so,the 4x1 diseqc switch is the simplest(although not the most efficient) switch for this job.As the cost of these has dropped,so has the quality.

Four LNB's to one receiver..........Again,reluctantly,the 4x1 diseqc is the simplest choice.


Two LNB's to three receivers..........4x4 multiswitch

Two LNB's to four receivers............4x4 multiswitch



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1 LNB = 1 sat bird..but for Dishnetwork TV, most people want 2 satellites,the 110 and 119 birds reception on each receiver..


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LNBF
1. Legacy:
a. single: called single legacy, one output.
b. dual: called dual legacy, 2 outputs.
c. twin: big fat lnbf, 2 outputs, has 2 SW21 switch built-in. (sw21 is not for FTA)
d. quad: big fat lnbf, 4 outputs, has 4 SW 21 switch built-in. (sw21 is not for FTA)
2: DishPro
a. single: called single DishPro, one ouput.
b. dual: called dual DishPro, 2 outputs.
c. twin: big fat lnbf, 2 outputs, has 2 independent Diseqc switch built-in (FTA-yes)
d. quad: big fat lnbf, 4 outputs, has 4 independent Diseqc switch built-in (FTA yes)

Dish Pro twin LNB gets both the 110 and 119 on 2 receivers..and no switches needed...

Dish pro LNB's cannot use legacy channel lists...need DP channel lists

sw21 switch are used with Dishnet receivers

disque switch is used with FTA receivers


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DUAL LNB is for 1 satellite signal (example 110) and 2 receivers...TWIN LNB aka fatboy/fathead is for 2 satellites ( Example..110 and 119) AND 2 receivers .. there is much confusion about DUAL vs TWIN LNB's

[Quote from thill1951]
(4) 4x4 multiswitch; 1 required for this installation,as well as 2 dual LNB's.The outputs from LNB #1 will go to Sat A inputs,and the outputs from LNB #2 will got to Sat B inputs.Do not be concerned with the 18v and 13v allocation,as the switch "freezes" these voltages within the unit.Set 1 sat to 22Khz ON,and the other to OFF(in your settings).
This unit can drive up to 4 receivers.
[end quote]


The idea to use the 4x4 22Khz sw is to replace four of Diseqc sw's. The 4x4 will take input from 2-dual legacy LNB's pointing to 2 birds (4 cables), four outputs will be connected to 4 FTA boxes. The FTA box SAT setup would be Diseqc sw OFF (or NONE), 22KHz sw ON for the first sat, and OFF for the 2nd.
I'll try over the weekend and post the result.
Thanks to everyone.

Let say I need to use the switch, where should I connect it : close to dish or closer to IRD and why?or it just doesn't matter as long as my cable is not longer than 100'

Let say I need to use the switch, where should I connect it : close to dish or closer to IRD and why?or it just doesn't matter as long as my cable is not longer than 100'
if you can install switch inside house that would be best to keep it out of the weather:) I also find closer to the reciever the better.

Switches always work better when closer to the equipment (receiver in this case) they are intended to "service"..

does sw21 work with coolsat 5000? I heard some people said it does and some said it doesn't. I currently have a dish 500 with twin lnb (build in sw21), does that work with coolsat 5000?

many thanks!

I am not sure about coolsat..but I am using sw44 with cnx trio and its working fine..what i wanna knw is did anyone try sw64 with FTA receivers?

I currently have a dish 500 with twin lnb (build in sw21), does that work with coolsat 5000?

many thanks!


Dish 500 with Twin LNB, is a Dish Pro (DP) LNB with a internal DP type switch, NOT a sw 21 switch...and that DOES work well with ANY FTA receiver...just make sure u have correct antenna settings in receiver....and run 1 cable DIRECTLY from LNB to receiver.

119 - disque 1....110 - #2
type.. ocs-dp
freq...11250
etc

great information man thanks was looking for it...goint to get second receiver and after reading that sure will help myself alot...thanks again...good work bro.

If using 2 receivers , then use same settings in BOTH receivers....and run 2 cables...1 directly to EACH receiver...

If U decide to add another dish and LNB, then things will change , and come back then, and get new info...an external switch (DP or disque) and different cabling config will be needed then..as well as additional antenna settings...but with the Twin LNB and 110-119 sats, U should have plenty of channels ...

ok im lost here now i have a dish installed and one lnb going to 3 recivers and i plane on adding more lnbs to get more birds. I do have a 2 4x1 DiSEqC Switch and i know i also have a SW2140 allready install is it posible to add in the 4x1's between the lnbs and the SW2140 or no?