Hi, my FTA box just died and the sales man told me that the Nfusion (IKS) was the way to go. No hassles, just plug in the Etherent and you never have to worry about it again, it does it all for you. My last FTA was pretty old but did the job...

What do you guys think?

I hear they work well-however they need your ip address-
as in give me your ss # ( or very simlar in concept) Korean
based (sounds like an easy pick if this company gets busted)
Masking the ip seems to not make them work.

Hi, my FTA box just died and the sales man told me that the Nfusion (IKS) was the way to go. No hassles, just plug in the Etherent and you never have to worry about it again, it does it all for you. My last FTA was pretty old but did the job...

What do you guys think?
........No...........get something that has good support and you wont be sorry ...................currently i would recomend one of two receivers and the names of both are viewsat and sonicview ..........good luck to ya .....

I have the Nfusion with netgear xe102.Wile others are getting new bins and keys I watch T.V..
I think of it as Viagra for T.V. It's always up.:wub:

I have the Nfusion with netgear xe102.Wile others are getting new bins and keys I watch T.V..
I think of it as Viagra for T.V. It's always up.:wub:

it may be always up....but i think it will take YOU down. not worth the risk. i'll wait for new bins.

I would much rather wait than have something directly linked to my comp....thats just asking for trouble...just my opinion...

seldom we have to wait longer than a few hours for a new viewsat update to be released...be damned if i'm gonna give my IP to anyone

Get a DB they are one of the best or the best out there and also do card share and is open source!!!

You require a constant internet hook-up to watch tv when using nfusion.
We have a dial up connection therefore this unit is no good for us.
We do not recommend. We have a unit that was delivered to us by mistake and we were never able to get it going using the internet, dial-up and a laptop computer.
If you are using high speed access then you need to buy a router!!

If Nfusion was using the internet access to download bins only and if they released stand alone bins then we think this box would be just as good as the other boxes out there.

We recommend doing lots of research before buying this box.

Currently testing:cs6000,cs8000hd,pansat3500sd

Ftahobby6

I have the Nfusion with netgear xe102.Wile others are getting new bins and keys I watch T.V..
I think of it as Viagra for T.V. It's always up.:wub:

imo you will eventually be watching tv from jail:yes: .nfusion is not worth the risk

I have the Nfusion with netgear xe102.Wile others are getting new bins and keys I watch T.V..
I think of it as Viagra for T.V. It's always up.:wub:

I sure all the guys in prison will be happy to hear that you're always up. :lol: :lol:

I sure all the guys in prison will be happy to hear that you're always up. :lol: :lol:

lmao:lol:

Has anyone gone to jail with this? I hardly think so since it is legal to own your own equipment...No one can enter your house over an Nfusion...Been thinking of getting one myself. Then again I work for the goverment and have access to senitors and congress, waiting for the dems to get in and have them re-write the laws to favor us again.

Has anyone gone to jail with this? I hardly think so since it is legal to own your own equipment...No one can enter your house over an Nfusion...Been thinking of getting one myself. Then again I work for the goverment and have access to senitors and congress, waiting for the dems to get in and have them re-write the laws to favor us again.

BTW all FTA'er want to get the laws in our favor vote DEM-o. Charle votes for the Elephants.

:blink: :blink:

Has anyone gone to jail with this? I hardly think so since it is legal to own your own equipment...No one can enter your house over an Nfusion...Been thinking of getting one myself. Then again I work for the goverment and have access to senitors and congress, waiting for the dems to get in and have them re-write the laws to favor us again.

so the government is going to favor us:o

:blink: :blink:
Oh Canda, sucks to be you....That's US fta'ers

you dam right the nfusion is the latest and the greatest. my nova works so well i've been sitting here and watching all you clowns sweat over new bins while my reciever never skips a beat.now i'm looking to invest in their newest hddvr with an external hard drive , now thats cool.
radarman

Oh Canda, sucks to be you....That's US fta'ers

What ever. :lol: :lol:

An attack on my country. That's really mature.

you dam right the nfusion is the latest and the greatest. my nova works so well i've been sitting here and watching all you clowns sweat over new bins while my reciever never skips a beat.now i'm looking to invest in their newest hddvr with an external hard drive , now thats cool.
radarman

you sound like a salesman:yes: .if it works for you thats great but when people ask for honest opinions about nfusion we are free to respond.there is a greater risk of being directley tracked useing nfusion.thats a fact

My opinion of IKS

Just fill out the form below. Because transmitting your IP addy every 8 seconds is the same thing.

Name:
Address:
Street name:
Zip / Postal code:
State / Province:

How long have you used IKS:
When would you like the police at your door?

JD , that's why you find an proxy server in South America, China, and Russia to bound your request off of. If you are smart enough to setup the Nfusion and open ports on a router. You should be smart enough to set the router to send all request annonymas through an proxy hiding you and your nfusion if you are worried about getting spoofed.

JD , that's why you find an proxy server in South America, China, and Russia to bound your request off of. If you are smart enough to setup the Nfusion and open ports on a router. You should be smart enough to set the router to send all request annonymas through an proxy hiding you and your nfusion if you are worried about getting spoofed.

if you really beleive that you can not be traced then good luck.i run many receivers includeing hd and at the end of the day i am worry free.you have your opinion and i have mine.good luck

if you really beleive that you can not be traced then good luck.i run many receivers includeing hd and at the end of the day i am worry free.you have your opinion and i have mine.good luck

I'll agree on that JD. If you feel that you can't bound and redirect your network setting then don't touch the Nfusion. See in my profession I skin hackers for a living so I have to be a hacker, thus making me rather hard for anyone to find me. See knowledge is power,itrully is and I know how networks work and how they are setup and such. If you use this site and not bounding your request to an proxy...That is just as dangerious as using the Nfusion...I'm not saying this to be insulting, I really want you to understand what you are speaking of, poison is poison JD.

so the government is going to favor us:o

I know I am wasting my fingers typing this but here is one point in history which the goverment havce supported FTA. Clinton enforced a law defending the U.S citizens right to own and operate your own cable and SAT gear, thus making it illegal for Comcast, Timewarrner, Direct TV, Dish Network, or any other company to come in and litarally steal your equipment as they did during the 80s.... Now I'm going to leave this boardf after I pick up what I came for.

JD , that's why you find an proxy server in South America, China, and Russia to bound your request off of. If you are smart enough to setup the Nfusion and open ports on a router. You should be smart enough to set the router to send all request annonymas through an proxy hiding you and your nfusion if you are worried about getting spoofed.

What is the point? With a proxy you are only hiding yourself from the Nfusion server and everything on the otherside of the proxy. That isn't the people you have to worry about. You need to worry about visibility from your side of the proxy and your ISP! Using a proxy in this case is like trying to hide your identity with a disguise only from the neck down.

JD , that's why you find an proxy server in South America, China, and Russia to bound your request off of. If you are smart enough to setup the Nfusion and open ports on a router. You should be smart enough to set the router to send all request annonymas through an proxy hiding you and your nfusion if you are worried about getting spoofed.
Wow!!!! How Do we do this?????

I'll agree on that JD. If you feel that you can't bound and redirect your network setting then don't touch the Nfusion. See in my profession I skin hackers for a living so I have to be a hacker, thus making me rather hard for anyone to find me. See knowledge is power,itrully is and I know how networks work and how they are setup and such. If you use this site and not bounding your request to an proxy...That is just as dangerious as using the Nfusion...I'm not saying this to be insulting, I really want you to understand what you are speaking of, poison is poison JD.

Please provide step by step instructions on how to protect our systems and run the Nfusion safely.
Most of us have no idea how to redirect our requests to South America, China, and Russia. Since you skin hackers for a living, I guess you would not have a job if all hackers used this method of directing their requests.
Thank You for sharing your most powerful knowledge with us.

Memphis is a real small town.

What is the point? You are only hiding yourself from the NFusion server and everything on the otherside of the proxy. That isn't the people you have to worry about. You need to worry about visibility from your side of the proxy and your ISP!

Since I have yet another preson who dose not understand I will clarify it. Once the packet hits the proxy the tcpip protcol is at it destination. The server re-prackages the file hence loosing the connection between you and the Nfusion server, meaning the encrypted header on the tcp-ip is between you and the proxy when your isp sees it, that Charle needs to get a search warrent even if that is legally possible.

Now it you really want to get sneaky, try a VPN, Cisco router + Cisco VPN + Proxy = that is tight security. I would love to see an ISP get away with cracking that becuase that's calling the Kettle Black , Pot...I'd sue my ISP so fricking fast and win the lawsuit then pay my way out of jail and then sue Charle for using illegally gained information and pimp him in Brazil as a gay guy.

Grasshopper, you left your nunchucks and some blood on the floor. <_< :D

arulin

IF you plan on hangin around here, lets watch the language, and edit the above.

Memphis is a real small town.

LOL, yes , you think I live in Memphis. Please. I've bounced my IP there yes but you think I am there. Nice try though I must admit.

ummm what??? was that an answer??? Little lost!!!lets see<_< nope no answer...LOL ok maybe croutching tiger may unduldge my ignorance with an answer that My useless thoughts can process? As for the Nfusion seems to much hastle for little gain! Please if I am wrong don't beat me with numchucks from hellfire.:wow: :p :beer:PS attacking members is a sure fire way to get a glimps of the dog house.

Wow!!!! How Do we do this?????



Please provide step by step instructions on how to protect our systems and run the Nfusion safely.
Most of us have no idea how to redirect our requests to South America, China, and Russia. Since you skin hackers for a living, I guess you would not have a job if all hackers used this method of directing their requests.
Thank You for sharing your most powerful knowledge with us.

There are ways around it to finding out as Magic0 tried, must admit that was a pretty darn close trace, have a few more servers to bypass. As for how to do this. I will provide it in a private message, it is prefectly lagel to use Proxy servers. I will say this though if you start using more then one you will need to edit some points like the HOST file. It definatily helps to cut down the tracking. I'll message you the base line instructions.

-----------------------

After reading Psychotic mesage and seeing the mock (that is a form of attack in it self) of what is of the fear the unknown... I pitty you...and if this board so wishes to place me in the "Dog house", give me a reason why and I will do one better I'll leave this board. As to what I've found here is a bunch of want to be SAT hackers. There is very little talk on KU or C band information or any knowledge sharing of technology period....Most of the post here is :my receiver down or bragging of what one has bought. On the other hand when it dose happen here I usurally read up on it and post what I've tried and the results. One reason why I've been here a year and three months and only posted 77 times. I posted a way of nerfing the risk of the Nfusion's systems. What do I get mocking hecklers. So don't put me in the Dog House I'll leave leave this site, just goto the place MAS gave me the address to over as year ago and frankly I enjoy the conversations there better then here.

ummm what??? was that an answer??? Little lost!!!lets see<_< nope no answer...LOL ok maybe croutching tiger may unduldge my ignorance with an answer that My useless thoughts can process? As for the Nfusion seems to much hastle for little gain! Please if I am wrong don't beat me with numchucks from hellfire.:wow: :p :beer:PS attacking members is a sure fire way to get a glimps of the dog house.

this is one of the tools>>

http://www.ip-adress.com/

Since I have yet another preson who dose not understand I will clarify it. Once the packet hits the proxy the tcpip protcol is at it destination. The server re-prackages the file hence loosing the connection between you and the Nfusion server,

No, it is not I who do not understand. As I said the main use of the proxy is to hide yourself from the Nfusion server. The info sent to the proxy must contain the address of the Nfusion server.

meaning the encrypted header on the tcp-ip is between you and the proxy when your isp sees it, that Charle needs to get a search warrent even if that is legally possible.

Charlie can get the legal documents required if he can convince a judge he has evidence that a crime is being comiited.

Now it you really want to get sneaky, try a VPN, Cisco router + Cisco VPN + Proxy = that is tight security. I would love to see an ISP get away with cracking that becuase that's calling the Kettle Black , Pot...I'd sue my ISP so fricking fast and win the lawsuit then pay my way out of jail and then sue Charle for using illegally gained information and pimp him in Brazil as a gay guy.

Well, you might have something there with VPN. Are there any obstacles to setting up IKS over VPN? And if this a practical solution why isn't it the recommended solution and Nfsuion supporting VPN? I assume you are not referring to high-priced enterprise routers.

No, it is not I who do not understand. As I said the main use of the proxy is to hide yourself from the Nfusion server. The info sent to the proxy must contain the address of the Nfusion server.



Charlie can get the legal documents required if he can convince a judge he has evidence that a crime is being comiited.



Well, you might have something there with VPN. Are there any obstacles to setting up IKS over VPN? And if this a practical solution why isn't it the recommended solution and Nfsuion supporting VPN? I assume you are not referring to high-priced enterprise routers.


I am in a way yet not Phant, you know that companies replace there old Cisco routers when the liencing for support is expired? Well if IKS would invest in a older Cisco router and build an application to VPN or suggest a VPN router like Linksys to thier customers yes the IPsec protocol would be a hard nut to crack open. Thankyou for claritying your reponces , it sometimes hard to know who is bneing a heckler and the trully interested over board messaging.

Working as closely with the GOV. as you do then you should know, that no matter where you step, you leave a mark in life, whether its on the internet or concrete. Why do you think that the worlds best KNOWN hackers are KNOWN. No matter how good you think you are there is someone who knows more than you. I am not here to bash or support the nfusion just to tell you that if they want to know who you are and where you are they will. And if they want in your house, you bet that they will have a warrant to get in.

Working as closely with the GOV. as you do then you should know, that no matter where you step, you leave a mark in life, whether its on the internet or concrete. Why do you think that the worlds best KNOWN hackers are KNOWN. No matter how good you think you are there is someone who knows more than you. I am not here to bash or support the nfusion just to tell you that if they want to know who you are and where you are they will. And if they want in your house, you bet that they will have a warrant to get in.

That's the way of life. Knowledge is evolution. True that one day I could wake up with the cops at the door, becuase I do play one nasty game of chess and bend the laws not break it. It all about what you know and can learn, guess how Bill Gates became the richest Geek on earth...He stole more then anby of you know and still hasn't gone to jail over it.

I remember the fuss about NAPSTER, that blew over a while back, I knew 1 of his offiliates just before the rucuss, she went by WaNtEd FBI KiLlEr she was good but she was knocked out of the game. Its all a game, we make a move they make a move, so on and so on. I have found that most of the best hackers do NOT promote their skills openly, they tend to stay quiet and thus staying just under the radar.

I remember the fuss about NAPSTER, that blew over a while back, I knew 1 of his offiliates just before the rucuss, she went by WaNtEd FBI KiLlEr she was good but she was knocked out of the game. Its all a game, we make a move they make a move, so on and so on. I have found that most of the best hackers do NOT promote their skills openly, they tend to stay quiet and thus staying just under the radar.

Thing is, the FBI can look here and have nothing becuase I know the laws. I have yet to break one. All I have talked about is how to connect to Proxy servers , which are legal, to bypass tcp-ip logging , also legal. So of the best hackers are those which make the law on thier side and poeple like you jealious of the fact.

Thing is, the FBI can look here and have nothing becuase I know the laws. I have yet to break one. All I have talked about is how to connect to Proxy servers , which are legal, to bypass tcp-ip logging , also legal. So of the best hackers are those which make the law on thier side and poeple like you jealious of the fact.
yah ok!!! If you cant handle fead back, don't leave open topics. Thats all I am out!!!!<_<

a swing and a hit! Thanks for the e-mail! Your respect is not needed!

a swing and a hit! Thanks for the e-mail! Your respect is not needed!

Well at least I said what I thought of you in private instead of making all of it on the @dirty luandary@ network. Besides all one must do is look at few of your post up to see why I see no reason to respect you...Please you have tried to provoke me for the past hour. Know what I enjoy burning you up. As for getting me in the dog house, buddy if I go there you should have the hut right next to me.

Hence for this for starters:

ummm what??? was that an answer??? Little lost!!!lets see nope no answer...LOL ok maybe croutching tiger may unduldge my ignorance with an answer that My useless thoughts can process? As for the Nfusion seems to much hastle for little gain! Please if I am wrong don't beat me with numchucks from hellfire. PS attacking members is a sure fire way to get a glimps of the dog house.

OK kids and you know who I am referring to...this is over :(

arulin,

Imo you have laid out some good points. Do you have any feedback on this http://secure-vpn.com/. I hate paying for anything I can do myself, but is this a viable option for securely running nfusion? Of course the absolute downside to this is the monthly fee. This question isn't just for arulin, it's for anyone that has feedback on it.

I think the community should be looking for ways to protect those who do run this system. Positive input is much better than all the negativity. I'll probably never run nfusion, but if I (We) can help members who do use it, protect themselves, then we all win! That's my 2cents and I'm sticking to it! :D

That's the way of life. Knowledge is evolution. True that one day I could wake up with the cops at the door, becuase I do play one nasty game of chess and bend the laws not break it. It all about what you know and can learn, guess how Bill Gates became the richest Geek on earth...He stole more then anby of you know and still hasn't gone to jail over it.

wow if you are as smart as you think you are then why do you even need to run fta at all:lol: .i would think with all your knowledge you would be another bill gates by now:o .btw you spelled any wrong

The simple matter is were you live that makes iks safe or not.

If you live in the states it has a risk since its possible they can go after you maybe.
If you live Canada then its a different story since the rcmp announced that they aren't going after the users.

Its far too hard to charge people there and all cases with fta have been tossed out, they do go after the sellers but not in the past year or because of fta.

Now this doesn't remove the fact that your stuck needing the computer where ever it is sending out the data but the only way these keep selling is if they keep working.

just because the rcmp says they aren't going after EU, doesn't mean the sat providers won't... maybe not jail,, but civil suits can get pretty pricey..

there were some very good points being made,, Cisco+VPN etc etc.... unfortunately, Nfusion doesn't subscribe to such things,, and until recently, didn't even see the NEED for Proxy support.. and their recent solutions fall very short of 'safe'...

maybe you should hire yourself out to the NFusion folks,, at least the EU might stand a fighting chance, instead of just letting themselves have NFusion leave their asses out for full view...

just because the rcmp says they aren't going after EU, doesn't mean the sat providers won't... maybe not jail,, but civil suits can get pretty pricey..

there were some very good points being made,, Cisco+VPN etc etc.... unfortunately, Nfusion doesn't subscribe to such things,, and until recently, didn't even see the NEED for Proxy support.. and their recent solutions fall very short of 'safe'...

maybe you should hire yourself out to the NFusion folks,, at least the EU might stand a fighting chance, instead of just letting themselves have NFusion leave their asses out for full view...

I would suggest you rethink things before your write them as your coming off as a smart ass.

First things first there has been no arrest or even court cases in years against a single user.
There has never been a successful case a fta user in Canada which is why the rcmp stopped going after them, total waste of time and money.

I never said that you can be traced back but that in itself takes time and money and it still proves nothing which is why it was dropped more then a few years ago by that other provider.

They are not going to go after the little person its to darn hard to prove anything and fixes nothing.

They stopped trying to close down stores since the fta is perfectly legal.

They have gone after the major players in civil court but that doesn't concern us and is likely going no where.

If you want to try and scare people into not buying them be my guest but give them all the facts and let them decide.

Oh you do know you ip can be tracked back to you computer by any have decent hacker regardless of how many jumps you do and it put you in precisely the same boat as the person with a nfusion.

Access to info but no way to prove what your using it for.

They said the same thing about directv. "Oh ..don't worry, you can say that HU Loader is for smart card security for Windows XP" Fact is, directv did extort millions out of over 100,000 individuals who purchased equipment.

Never say never. Just because it hasn't happened....YET.

Has anyone gone to jail with this? I hardly think so since it is legal to own your own equipment...No one can enter your house over an Nfusion...Been thinking of getting one myself. Then again I work for the goverment and have access to senitors and congress, waiting for the dems to get in and have them re-write the laws to favor us again.

Prison sentences for copyright infringement in South Korea.

9 January 2007

Prison sentences for copyright infringement in South Korea.

A South Korean court handed down a prison sentence to exporters who descrambled signals from
satellite broadcasters which are scrambled to prevent piracy.

The Seoul Central District Court said it has convicted the entrepreneurs for infringing upon
copyrights of satellite broadcasters in Europe and Arab countries by providing the TV piracy
technology.

The court sentenced two heads of IT companies, identified only by their surnames Jeong and Lee, to
eight months in prison suspended for two years, and another entrepreneur whose family name is Sim
to six months in jail, suspended for two years.

They were accused of exporting illegal set-top boxes for receiving satellite TV signals and
transmitting "control words," data for descrambling signals, to buyers of the receivers on a
real-time basis. Judge Rho Tae-ak said: "The behaviour of the accused ran against the domestic
copyright law, which is very dangerous for the country's external credibility considering the
worldwide trend of strengthening copyright protection.” The three companies were also sentenced to
pay 30 million won (US$32,190) in fines.

According to prosecutors, Jeong and Lee sold 35,000 illegal satellite TV receivers worth 3.5
billion won in total to the Middle East and Europe that enabled buyers to view paid TV channels
for free from October 2005 through June last year. Sim allegedly sold 4,000 such devices for
viewing Polish satellite channels for free in May and June of 2005. Prosecutors began probing the
case after such satellite broadcasters as Showtime, Nova, ADD and Polsat filed a complaint through
a South Korean law firm.

Card Sharing Bust sets Precedence

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

According to a press release, published January 23, 2007
AEPOC, the European Association for the Protection of Encrypted Works and Services, looks back on a successful year 2007 with many anti-piracy measures effectively accomplished – and expects national law enforcement bodies as well as EU regulators to continue to narrow down the living space for pirates during 2008.

In the year 2007 ending session in December of AEPOC’s Board of Directors and Ordinary General Assembly meetings held in Brussels, Members reported several anti-piracy cases that effectively prove the increased attention and activity of law enforcement entities to combat audio-visual piracy: One strong case was presented by AEPOC Member TV Cabo Portugal: The country’s ever-first judgement by a Portuguese court foresees imprisonment of 80 days against two Pay-TV pirates having dealt with piracy equipment, being about to enter into force.

Moreover the Portuguese Judiciary Police conducted a big operation against Pay-TV piracy associated to ‘card-sharing’: The police action has dismantled several servers, that illegally gave access to Pay-TV channels – and additionally seized more than 1,000 smart cards as well as miscellaneous equipment such as routers, card-writers and “Dreamboxes” in a total of eleven searches. Accordingly, the Portuguese Judiciary Police gave another clear signal in successfully combating this type of organized crime.

In regards to card sharing another case from Australia has brought up a ground-breaking judgement – providing important judicial guidance to Australian courts – potentially also serving as a precedent on an international basis: The world’s first judgement in any jurisdiction dealing with card sharing has found that a company called “The Mod Shop” had implemented a strategy, which involved providing purchasers of satellite TV equipment with the mean to access Australian Pay-TV without authorisation. The judge specifically ruled that programmed smart cards but also card-sharing hardware and software were illegal “broadcast decoding devices” – making this world’s first sentence against card-sharing piracy possible, resulting in fines of more than one million AUS$ or approximately Euro 600,000.
Just recently in early January 2008, AEPOC Member AMC (Arab Media Corporation and shareholder of ART and ADD Europe) reported a judgement in a court in Amman, Jordan, of a pirate dealer sentenced to one year in prison, besides a US$ 8,500 fine and seizure of all equipment. The pirate was found guilty of IP infringement for the sale of two ”Dreamboxes“ which enabled the end user to watch Pay-TV without a subscription. This is a landmark case in satellite piracy in Jordan, designed to send a strong message to the pirate community that the country says NO to piracy.

AEPOC President Jean Grenier commented: “We do welcome the overall increased attention and success rate of European and international law enforcement. Still, AEPOC suggests in general to European regulators to develop a more sufficiently dissuasive legal framework that makes more extreme rulings such as imprisonment only necessary in the most severe cases. Nevertheless, jail seems applicable in cases, that more than blatantly ignore the law”.


info has been out for a year or more and yet some still persist.

They said the same thing about directv. "Oh ..don't worry, you can say that HU Loader is for smart card security for Windows XP" Fact is, directv did extort millions out of over 100,000 individuals who purchased equipment.

Never say never. Just because it hasn't happened....YET.


I prefer erroring on the side of caution and more so when i had a few too many beer...lol.


Yeah i remember those days but that was more a case of websites and the like with purchasing info.

Now iam not saying it perfectly safe its not, but then again none of the stuff we do is perfectly safe and thats the risk we take doing it.

Its better to give the person all the facts rather then try and scare them into not doing something.
I tend to believe that most can make their own choice as long as they know what there getting into.

I also believe this is one of the better places to do it.

as I said, just because the rcmp doesn't want the EU,, doesn't mean the providers don't,,,
PROVE ME WRONG,, before you go calling me an ass..

btw,, YOU CAN"T,, just because it may not have happened yet (that you know of) doesn't mean it won't... unless YOU can predict the future..

which I'm positive YOU can't.. (as I can't either,, but, unlike you, tend to learn from history),,

oh... forgot..
your IP comment,,, hilarious...;
no, I don't use a proxy,, no, I don't test,, so who cares.. my IP is all over the place,, IF i tested, I would certainly use a proxy,

and no... my IP isn't hitting up an illegal server every 8 seconds,, my IP may show me hitting a server and getting information?? sure,,, but not every 8 seconds,, not grabbing control words every 8 seconds,, not an illegal server..

get it yet??

as I said, just because the rcmp doesn't want the EU,, doesn't mean the providers don't,,,
PROVE ME WRONG,, before you go calling me an ass..

btw,, YOU CAN"T,, just because it may not have happened yet (that you know of) doesn't mean it won't... unless YOU can predict the future..

which I'm positive YOU can't.. (as I can't either,, but, unlike you, tend to learn from history),,

Actually can quite easly heck for that matter you can.

And it wasn't what you said its how you said it.

There are ways of disagreeing with someone and putting down there opinions on the subject you chose to ignore that.

As for bell they haven't civily gone after a fta owner in court for a very simple reason its impossible to prove.

You explain to the people here just how they are going to prove your doing anything wrong baring you opening your door and showing them your doing just that.

They have no other way of finding out since the rcmp wont get involved and this doesn't fall on police preview.

Even if i couldn't prove it which anyone easily can here its all about common sense no company is going to go after the little guy in a impossible to prove case spend a insane amount of money trying.

If it was easily proven then they may try it in a effort to get money but even thing it a 50/50 toss up if it would be worth it.

No a company goes after the source or removes the weakness that left them open and stop the whole problem in one shoot.

A really good example is direct they tried it and fixed there problem with the new card.
They only went after a few home users and only when they has a direct money trail from a supplier and even that they gave up on since it was too hard to prove wrong doing.

So if you think you can convince someone that a huge company is going to spend money going after the little guy when its impossible to prove they used data for wrong doing go ahead.
That of course would require you to ignore precedents set by both direct and dish in this regard but that your choice.

If one wants to err on the side of caution, one doesn't use IKS. There was a time in the US when no one was charged with a crime for downloading MP3s of copyrighted works. That ended abruptly. That no one has been charged with a crime in the US for using IKS has a lot to do with it being a relatively recent phenomena. I don't think it was even a known method in use against Bell when all the Canadian decisions were made.

A particularly interesting situation exists in Canada with the sat provider also being a major Internet provider. One would think they would eventually stop it from working on the Networks they control. They aren't likely to face the same kind of problems US Internet providers would if they attempted this.

It all comes down to this: Can someone on the Internet tell when you are operating a FTA unit to receive DN without card sharing (IKS)? No, they can't. Can someone on the Internet tell when you are operating a FTA unit to receive DN with IKS? Yes, they can.

So, then the issue is whether or not one thinks that anything can be made of someone showing you are receiving Dish Net's decrypted Control Words every 8 seconds. I would think they would have a case that you are using a technique that violates the DCM act. If you didn't violate the act, how did you end up with something that was heavily encrypted in order to secure access? Isn't this exactly the type of thing that the DCMA was designed to make illegal? I think any card sharing problem with Dave preceded the DCM act.

Some will claim that IKS encryption prevents anyone from knowing what is in the packets you receive every 8 seconds. Well there aren't that many bits in a Control Word and DN obviously knows what the Control Words are. So how good is encryption when only a few bytes (Eight I think, two of which are checksums) are involved and one knows what the encrypted content is!? I think that makes it rather easy to break the encryption. Probably something DN could also easily do by buying an Nfusion receiver. After all their encryption isn't protected with anything as fancy as a smart card.

If you turn on IKS, will DN be knocking on your door within a month? Not likely. You are probably safe using it until the card swap is implemented. But if it becomes a significant problem for DN after the swap, you can expect them to do something to stop it. And I wouldn't rule out DN making an example of a few people. They won't be able to go after everyone, but I would prefer not to be in the fishing pool.

So if you think you can convince someone that a huge company is going to spend money going after the little guy

It is a common technique of huge companies. The fact that they are huge means they have plenty of money to spend on things like this. They like to make examples of a few to scare away the many.

when its impossible to prove they used data for wrong doing
Merely having the data is proof that wrong doing occured. But if you don't believe that having the data violates the DCMA, showing that you received the data which is likely to have been used to commit a crime could be used to gain access to your residence. That happens all the time.


That of course would require you to ignore precedents set by both direct and dish in this regard but that your choice.

I don't think that there are have been any relevant precedents set with regard to the DCMA and one receiving decrypted Control Words. But let the user decide, if they think they know the law inside out and are safe with IKS, well then have at it. None IKS solutions are better suited for those not so expert with the law.

In one of these statements a man made a statement that he wont give his IP address to anyone...I dont understand because I belonged to a forum that , if you dissagred with ANYTHING the Admin,s stated you would get thrown out, of course I did and got thrown out. A month later I got back on with a diff username and password..again, I made a simple statement, no derogatory, just expressing MY views and told them this was the second time I had beem banned...next time I logged on..banned for life by IP address!!I never willinglty gave it so if they did me..what makes this guy here say..I wont give them my IP when they were able to get mine? I am not a comp wiz so it must be something I dont understand on how they knew it...thanks

In one of these statements a man made a statement that he wont give his IP address to anyone...I dont understand because I belonged to a forum that , if you dissagred with ANYTHING the Admin,s stated you would get thrown out, of course I did and got thrown out. A month later I got back on with a diff username and password..again, I made a simple statement, no derogatory, just expressing MY views and told them this was the second time I had beem banned...next time I logged on..banned for life by IP address!!I never willinglty gave it so if they did me..what makes this guy here say..I wont give them my IP when they were able to get mine? I am not a comp wiz so it must be something I dont understand on how they knew it...thanks

What he meant was he wouldn't use the service. That is how he would withhold his IP address. If he used the service, his IP would be known to the service and other potential snoops.

Wow! I just need a new receiver...

I didn't mean to cuase such a commotion.

Well I can't say which direction I'm going to go but I do appreciate everyone's opinions. You guys made it even tougher!!!

Thank you...

I would have thought it would have been easier? Oh well...

It is a common technique of huge companies. The fact that they are huge means they have plenty of money to spend on things like this. They like to make examples of a few to scare away the many.


Merely having the data is proof that wrong doing occured. But if you don't believe that having the data violates the DCMA, showing that you received the data which is likely to have been used to commit a crime could be used to gain access to your residence. That happens all the time.




I don't think that there are have been any relevant precedents set with regard to the DCMA and one receiving decrypted Control Words. But let the user decide, if they think they know the law inside out and are safe with IKS, well then have at it. None IKS solutions are better suited for those not so expert with the law.

It was tried it didn't work they ended up paying and it was quickly abandoned by direct tv and this was when they had actually sales records.

Nope to the second one since were not talking dmca and as the rcmp have already public stated there is no edvadince that home users are doing wrong.
The mistake most make is that they think this doesn't include iks but thats a mistake since iks is hardly new.

There have actually been a few and as i already stated iks has been around a long time and even longer then the current fta boom.

That all being said it like all fta aren't risk free but its no more risky then the others.
The real risk here is that without the iks the receiver would be pretty looking and not much else which has happened in the past to different iks models.

Laws do change though so its always good to keep up on your reading.

Rule of thumb if you don't feel safe don't buy and try to avoid using credit cards because if fta does become illegal you really dont need a paper trail.

Although my rcmp cousin owns a nfusion and he don't seem worried...lol.

Wow! I just need a new receiver...

I didn't mean to cuase such a commotion.

Well I can't say which direction I'm going to go but I do appreciate everyone's opinions. You guys made it even tougher!!!

Thank you...

Ahh some of us just like a good debate...lol.

Ever now and then someone does tend to forget that it should remain polite.

Go with what you feel comfortable with and do your own homework so your personally informed not just listening to us debate things.:)

It was tried it didn't work they ended up paying and it was quickly abandoned by direct tv and this was when they had actually sales records.

What was tried? So you are claiming that Dave's legal tactics against the consumer had no affect!? I don't remember them being abandoned all that quickly.

Nope to the second one since were not talking dmca and as the rcmp have already public stated there is no evidence that home users are doing wrong. The mistake most make is that they think this doesn't include iks but thats a mistake since iks is hardly new.

The RCMP did not state that. They simply stated that they are not motivated to persue individual users. I think you will find the same applies to US troopers. It isn't they you have to be worried about it. It is the sat providers bringing cases. They don't need police to do that, nor will police stand in their way if they have a legitimate case. When the sat providers state they aren't going to persue individual users then can throw caution to the wind. The DCMA IS relevant for users in the US, not Canada.

There have actually been a few and as i already stated iks has been around a long time and even longer then the current fta boom.

I don't believe it was ever as popular as it is now. This is especially true in Europe. And as I have already stated, the DCMA hasn't been around nearly as long.

That all being said it like all fta aren't risk free but its no more risky then the others.

Nonsense. That IKS is riskier than "regular" FTA is obvious. It is as simple as that one can use FTA anonymously while one cannot use IKS anonymously.

The real risk here is that without the iks the receiver would be pretty looking and not much else which has happened in the past to different iks models.

Not true. IKS is an option of the receiver. You can also use it like other FTAs, you don't have to use IKS.

Laws do change though...

Exactly. As do legal tactics, legal interpretations, plans and methods of attack, regardless of what one has said in the past. And usually someone finds out about these changes the hard way.

Ever now and then someone does tend to forget that it should remain polite.

:)

yes, I don't consider calling someone an ass being polite, or did you forget that?
your convoluted logic escapes me.. and your pushing the safety of IKS worries me greatly..

yes, I don't consider calling someone an ass being polite, or did you forget that?
your convoluted logic escapes me.. and your pushing the safety of IKS worries me greatly..

Your posts for the others weren't very polite either were they .

You started that tact not anyone else here but in the interest of the forum shall we not let it pass and move on now?

Iam not pushing iks i merely saying that the risks are hardly what you make them out to be, this isn't a new tech its been around some time.

Phant

Time is relative to us all but the fact remains its was abandoned and has never been tried since and cost them money because they lost.

In the original statement given to the press on hard copy (paper) the reason given for not being motivated were just as i stated.
Yes of course a court case can be brought against anyone at any time thats a fact of live that we live in and yes in the stated the dcma could be used in the states since these days its used for everything else.

Iks was even more wide spread back then then it was now and then a falling out between suppliers and providers killed the whole mess and this is only this side of the pond.

We leave trials all over the place when we go to websites look for info which are hardly secure in most cases so i think we tend to have this illusion we are unseen.
Is iks more or less secure we can debate five was from sunday but the reality at this point is its been around for ages and has proved to be no more risk then a standard stb.
The moment that it does or if it does though well show a turning point and then the risk can be called real.

Guess this is really what this is just our own personal thoughts on the matter since nothing has happened.
The only real prove for either of us is if ten years from now when this is all over and done and nothing happened then i was correct.
Or next year they go after someone because they own a nfusion.

Tell then were just both doing best guess and offering our opinions.


Oh nfusions may be able to do the bin thing but that requires bins which are no longer being put out so no iks no tv.
Mind you it can still be used as a true fta.

Iks was even more wide spread back then then it was now and then a falling out between suppliers and providers killed the whole mess and this is only this side of the pond.

Impossible. What year are you talking about? FTA units probably exceed DTV's entire customer base back then.

We leave trials all over the place when we go to websites look for info which are hardly secure in most cases so i think we tend to have this illusion we are unseen.

Absolutely irrelevant. Reading a web site isn't a crime in N.A. Neither is downloading a FTA bin.

Is iks more or less secure we can debate five was from sunday but the reality at this point is its been around for ages and has proved to be no more risk then a standard stb.
The moment that it does or if it does though well show a turning point and then the risk can be called real.

The risk of using a stb approaches zero. The risk of using IKS is high. Your argument is that the danger is the same, regardless of the riskiness of the behaviour, because you believe the providers will not target individual customers. If that is true, and remains true, then there is no danger with IKS. As soon as it is no longer true then there is danger in the riskier behaviour of using IKS.

Is it riskier to rob a bank with a disguise or without? There is no disguise with IKS. Of course there is no danger if no one cares if you rob the bank. Is it riskier to swim underwater into an enemy's harbour with a re-breather (no bubbles) or with SCUBA (bubbbles)? There is no danger if no one is watching or no one cares. But leaving a trail of bubbles to show your presence is a riskier behavior. And IKS leaves a constant trail of bubbles whenever it is in use.

Oh nfusions may be able to do the bin thing but that requires bins which are no longer being put out so no iks no tv.
Mind you it can still be used as a true fta.

That makes Nfusion even less attractive.

The real problem here with the arguments is both yours and mine are based on our own opinions of their past behavior.

Can they go after iks yes.

Can they go after fta..yes and don't for a moment think that the word safe can be applied to it these kinds of sales attract attention.
The notices of be careful what you post wouldn't be on ever sites otherwise.

The scuba choice was a bad one since by posting here and other sites we leave a trail just as easy to see as any ika.

For that matter there seems to be this prevailing myth that ika these days actually shares keys which it doesn't and hasn't for sometimes(the name doesn't help).

The real issue as i mentioned is this is all best guess.

Your guess what they well do iam guessing what they won't do.

For now and tell something does happen it has no track record of being any more riskier then a normal fta.

At this point and time its a sure bet that its offers no more risk then any fta for the simple reason of the card swap.
If that fails then its anyones guess but tell then you can bet their hoping to kill the whole issue in one shot.

The real problem here with the arguments is both yours and mine are based on our own opinions of their past behavior.

That is true about our perception of what the providers might do. It is not true of which way of "testing" is riskier. You assume they will remain inert, impotent. That is possible, but I don't want to risk my security on that always remaining true.


Can they go after iks yes.

Can they go after fta..yes and don't for a moment think that the word safe can be applied to it these kinds of sales attract attention.

It is perfectly legal to buy a FTA box. And there is no way to tell that you are operating a FTA box (as long as you aren't using IKS) that you have modified to receive scrambled content. As long as you don't reveal that information yourself. They have gone after Viewsat and Coolsat, etc. by suing them but there is no technology to go after individual FTA uers. If you want to insist that FTA is not safe well then give it a 1 on a scale of 1 to 10 for risk. (Of course it can be 0 if one is smart.) IKS gets a 10 on the same scale. The only thing riskier would be trying to run a cable into Dishnet's upload centre or perhaps trying to tap into DTV's air-gapped network to get the keys! :)



The notices of be careful what you post wouldn't be on ever sites otherwise.

The scuba choice was a bad one since by posting here and other sites we leave a trail just as easy to see as any ika.

It is very fuzzy thinking that would lead one to conclude that. Yes, you leave a trail if you post. But of course you don't have to post to use any type of FTA. And if you want to post you can do it anonymously from a library, Kinkos, etc. It is very easy to hide from an occasional post. You don't have that option with IKS. You need to download a different control word for every 8 seconds of video and every time you change channels.


For that matter there seems to be this prevailing myth that ika these days actually shares keys which it doesn't and hasn't for sometimes(the name doesn't help).

Well then explain exactly what it does. Because that kind of statement is taken right out of the IKS shill's playbook. Does it not download decrypted Control Words? And are not these control words the keys for the Common Scrambling Algorithm? It think it is aptly named for those that understand what it is doing. It just isn't sharing Nagra keys, which is why it needs to request a key (for CSA) every 8 seconds. There are always tattletale "bubbles" with IKS. With FTA, unlike IKS, you can be as stealthy as you wish.

The real issue as i mentioned is this is all best guess.

The guess is only if a provider will set out to bite your ass. It isn't a guess which technology hides your ass and which technology leaves your ass hanging out; that is IKS.

For that matter there seems to be this prevailing myth that ika these days actually shares keys which it doesn't and hasn't for sometimes(the name doesn't help).
OK, if it does not share keys, then what does it share? How does it work?


"It stays updated via IKS (Internet Key Service) using the same internet connection as your home computer .

You need to connect directly to your internet connection via a wireless router or LAN connection. Once set up it can download all the updates it will need for itself .

You will never have to take your receiver to the computer and run all sorts of programs because those programs are now built right in are automatically executed when necessary ."

Is this quote true? It sounds like a lot more than keys are being updated.

Has anyone gone to jail with this? I hardly think so since it is legal to own your own equipment...No one can enter your house over an Nfusion...Been thinking of getting one myself. Then again I work for the goverment and have access to senitors and congress, waiting for the dems to get in and have them re-write the laws to favor us again.

You only have to go once, why be the first.... just send them you address to save them trouble

set top box is sold commonly if you own one it is a consumer product
my fusion went down for 5 minutes came back up pretty cool gadget
thats what it is, if you want to be pefectly legal about it just point your dish to other sats and watch fta channels


nova
cw
cs

set top box is sold commonly if you own one it is a consumer product
my fusion went down for 5 minutes came back up pretty cool gadget
thats what it is, if you want to be pefectly legal about it just point your dish to other sats and watch fta channels


nova
cw
cs

Then why have IKS? It's not needed for true FTA.

Amen!!

it self updates the epg. nf fta reciever its been working okay since i set it up.

thedssguy's Avatar
thedssguy Online
Visiting Mod/Admin

Posts: 222
Join Date: May 2005
Report Post
Default Re: The IKS thread - Yesterday, 09:49 PM
Infusion, Emtech, Neosat, Neusat all running iks servers in the same building in Malaysia. When the shit hits the fan, they'll all go down, and of course the end user ip's will be traceable.
Reply With Quote

thedssguy's Avatar
thedssguy Online
Visiting Mod/Admin

Posts: 222
Join Date: May 2005
Report Post
Default Re: The IKS thread - Yesterday, 09:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega3 View Post
I do thank you for your honesty with that post TDG,,,
but, do you think DN really needed that confirmation??
LOL, You seriously think they don't have that information?

Yes, Emtech is Tessat. The shit is fixn to hit the fan, but I & others have warned people from the very beginning about iks.. shrug.. Guess we'll soon see it play out..sad but inevitable.

from the horse's (a$$) mouth... for all you unbelievers